[August]

sonic weaponry

[Blink]

Lol spence, what a retard.


Also sometimes the gov. has undercover instigators at peaceful protests, to start violence and give the police excuse to start randomly hitting, spraying, and corralling.

[mike]

Originally Posted by Blink

Also sometimes the gov. has undercover instigators at peaceful protests, to start violence and give the police excuse to start randomly hitting, spraying, and corralling.

proof?

[Cygnus]

It's not that far fetched.

I feel like an angsty tool/retard when I think that violent revolution is the only way the make real change happen, but it's becoming increasingly apparent...

[mike]

Originally Posted by Cygnus

It's not that far fetched.

I feel like an angsty tool/retard when I think that violent revolution is the only way the make real change happen, but it's becoming increasingly apparent...

still wrong, and part of the problem

non violent civil disobedience is the only way, it is impossible to combat

go ahead and try to start a violent revolution, you will get smacked the fuck down so quick you won't know what happened, violent rebellions are easy to quell

[Cygnus]

I'm not advocating violent rebellion dude, I'm just trying to speculate. The government doesn't draw it's power from the people anymore, it's been bought from under us. How has civil disobedience been any different than passive complacency? People have been in disgust at what has been going on for the past decades and it only shows signs of getting worse. As long as fear and misinformation divides and inflames us against each other while corporations effortlessly manage the government for us, do we really wield any power?

I'm not really even defending a position or saying I'm right at this point, I'm just spilling my mind and typing what seems apparent to me. If I'm dead wrong don't just tell me I'm wrong, explain to me.

[mike]

Originally Posted by Cygnus

I'm not advocating violent rebellion dude, I'm just trying to speculate. The government doesn't draw it's power from the people anymore, it's been bought from under us.

as long as we are the consumers, we wield all the power

sure, our representatives are owned by corporations, but those corporations are reliant on us to buy their products

we support them, not the other way around

Originally Posted by Cygnus

How has civil disobedience been any different than passive complacency? People have been in disgust at what has been going on for the past decades and it only shows signs of getting worse. As long as fear and misinformation divides and inflames us against each other while corporations effortlessly manage the government for us, do we really wield any power?

huge difference, actively boycotting and refusing to cooperate with the corporate agenda (strikes, etc) is much different than just passively going about your day indignantly

Originally Posted by Cygnus

I'm not really even defending a position or saying I'm right at this point, I'm just spilling my mind and typing what seems apparent to me. If I'm dead wrong don't just tell me I'm wrong, explain to me.

that is tedious though

and everything i said more than likely won't happen, all i'm worried about is finding someone to love, let someone else fight

[johncootrane]

I have been studying this recently. This entire talk about the redundancy of the US. Disgust does not even describe what I feel about this subject.
Watching Capitalism: A Love Story made me want to burn down banks.

[wangless]

You guys want to organize and start protests?

[johncootrane]

Im only down for riots.

[Blink]

I live in the most conservative part of the bible belt. I would start a grassroots movement, but it would be completely pointless. Not only is there nothing to protest, thus not being able to change anything -- but the people here are basically the Tea Party "activists," which are still blinded and fully invested in the left/right paradigm.

Really my only legitimate options here are to starve the beast, and inform the public as much as I can. Starving the beast involves not buying at Wal-Mart, using LOCAL banks, not national banks, etc.. And as far as informing the public goes, in the most conservative part of Texas... it's a pain in the ass that I really don't want to waste my time with, besides street art.


And I agree with Mike that at this point, civil disobedience is the only way... BUT, I really don't see that winning. Germany fought it's fascist police state with rebel groups like the RAF, which basically used acts of terrorism against fascist officials. Germany was forced to reevaluate it's operations, and in the end you could say the rebel groups "won." But that was during the 60's and 70's.

Now, not only do we have Godmode Intelligence agencies that can find out anything about anyone at any time, tap any phone, easily trace all computer activity, etc... But now Posse Comitatus isn't even in effect. Which means that if Martial Law is declared by the president, ANY part of the military can be used against us. Yes, even the Marines, Delta Force, Seals, etc...which is a battle already lost. However that's not to say that a violent revolution wouldn't change anything. The government wouldn't just exterminate everyone until there were no more dissenters... eventually with enough civilian casualties, either other countries would get involved, or the gov. would take a step back and try to work with the people once enough blood was shed.


I'm still on the fence though. I think civil disobedience is the way to go, like Mike is saying, but on the other hand, I believe that we won't ever have enough people to effectively disobey civilly, and that a violent revolution is the only way we'll ever truly change.


Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable.
-JFK

The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
-Thomas Jefferson

[August]

Originally Posted by Blink

I live in the most conservative part of the bible belt. I would start a grassroots movement, but it would be completely pointless. Not only is there nothing to protest, thus not being able to change anything -- but the people here are basically the Tea Party "activists," which are still blinded and fully invested in the left/right paradigm.

Really my only legitimate options here are to starve the beast, and inform the public as much as I can. Starving the beast involves not buying at Wal-Mart, using LOCAL banks, not national banks, etc.. And as far as informing the public goes, in the most conservative part of Texas... it's a pain in the ass that I really don't want to waste my time with, besides street art.


And I agree with Mike that at this point, civil disobedience is the only way... BUT, I really don't see that winning. Germany fought it's fascist police state with rebel groups like the RAF, which basically used acts of terrorism against fascist officials. Germany was forced to reevaluate it's operations, and in the end you could say the rebel groups "won." But that was during the 60's and 70's.

Now, not only do we have Godmode Intelligence agencies that can find out anything about anyone at any time, tap any phone, easily trace all computer activity, etc... But now Posse Comitatus isn't even in effect. Which means that if Martial Law is declared by the president, ANY part of the military can be used against us. Yes, even the Marines, Delta Force, Seals, etc...which is a battle already lost. However that's not to say that a violent revolution wouldn't change anything. The government wouldn't just exterminate everyone until there were no more dissenters... eventually with enough civilian casualties, either other countries would get involved, or the gov. would take a step back and try to work with the people once enough blood was shed.


I'm still on the fence though. I think civil disobedience is the way to go, like Mike is saying, but on the other hand, I believe that we won't ever have enough people to effectively disobey civilly, and that a violent revolution is the only way we'll ever truly change.

summary: civil disobedience wont work, violent revolution wont work, government > us, dont like it then you can geeet OUT